Guantanamo inmate told "You can't return to UK"

[nekokate]

[faceless]

To be honest I find a few incongruities in this story. The 'Father's Day' appeal by the children just sounds wrong; it's not a big deal in Britain and I'd imagine even less so in Moslem families, though I may be wrong... Secondly, and more notably, how does a refugee find the cash to go to West Africa to set up a business?

I'm completely in favour of genuine people being helped, but this really does sound dodgy.

[major.tom]

I think it is obscene, if only because the reason his visa elapsed was because he was allegedly kidnapped and flown to a place and held outside the law.

However, I don't think being a refugee and having enough dosh to set up a business are mutually exclusive. He could've been a political refugee, fleeing persecution. I don't know the details, but given what he's been through, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. (Which is, I think, what we should do for anyone... until they've been shown to repeatedly abuse this goodwill.)

If MI-5 does have any dirt on him, let him back in and give him due process, I say.

[mickyv]

I find it despicably inhumane, and the fact they his family are certain that his will be imprisoned & tortured if sent to Jordan back makes it doubly so, plus it also would indicate that he is probably a political refugee.

I find Faceless remarks about his children not thinking about their father on Father’s Day, when they live in a culture where they cannot avoid this sentimental commercialism, quite callous. Sorry Faceless, but that’s how it comes across to me.

[faceless]

Callous? - It's a sentimentalised story in the first place and I'm reacting against it.

[Mandy]

Yep .. it is callous how he was treated. Since we presume innocence, an innocent person was held for years away from his family.

[faceless]

Until I see more information about the man I'm not believing anything about his situation, positive or negative.

[mickyv]

Yes we don’t know all the details about this specific case, but just as a matter of interest Faceless, do you think I’m correct in stating that all except a small handful from the many hundreds that have been held, have ever been declared to be involved in terrorism, and only 2 have ever been so much as charged nevermind convicted. And that perhaps yes not all are innocent of “terrorism”, but don’t you agree with me that the overwhelming majority (whom would never have been legally detained in Britain or even in the US itself), are only there because of unlucky circumstance, especially the huge number that were sold into American custody by Afghan Warlords on no other criteria except the tempting US cash rewards for turning in “militants” ?

[faceless]

I don't agree that the majority are there because they're innocent bystanders, no. How many innocent people do you know who fly off to warzones?

I'm not saying for a minute that they're all guilty, because it's clear that American and British forces have colluded to allow this system of fear to be put in place, but whose to say these Afghan Warlords were lying or are that corrupt? Maybe they were given an ultimatum such as "Give up the ones who aren't from here or we'll blow the hell out of every building and farm for a hundred miles around." In that situation I'd give them up too.

[mickyv]

Interesting, are you always so suspicious ? I only tend to be in response to the official line /(lies) rather than because it tells me to.

Hardly flying to War Zones for the majority who were kidnapped from where they live, mainly Afghanistan & Pakistan, and for those who were from elsewhere, could there not be valid legitimate reasons why they could have been there ? Visiting family, attending Weddings (Tipton Three) ?

Warlords being corrupt ! Who could imagine such a thing ! I think you’ll find that these ruthless murderers didn’t have to be coerced into handing over people who after all were their enemies for many years.

[faceless]

Yes, I am always suspicious of what sounds like sentimentalised bollocks. You should be too.

[faceless]

I just found this page:

http://www.cageprisoners.com/prisoners.php?id=163

It does sound pretty terrible what he's been through, but seeing that the Spanish authorities want to extradite him for Al-Qaeda related crimes is quite a flag.

[mickyv]

Unbelievable ! Not just what he’s been through, but that the Spanish think that they have enough evidence to convict him and he was not passed over to them !

[mickyv]

Sorry to come back to this again Faceless, but I’m still troubled about your “sentimentalised bollocks” sentiment. If I’m reading you correctly it seems that you find it hard to believe that the man’s young children genuinely miss their father. Do you not believe that they miss him every day, yes including Fathers Day, even painfully including Father’s Day no less ? Do you not believe that the day of his homecoming will be the best day in the lives of his family ? Or are you really cynical hardhearted enough to believe this is a false publicity ploy by Al Quada to try and get a “terrorist” sprung ? Do you think his 10 year old works for Al Quada ?

Sorry to go on about this, but as a Father of a young boy I know how he misses me when I’m away, and this story has touch a raw nerve with me, plus your attitude on this reminds me of the US military spokesman who infamously accused three Guantanomo inmates who had just been driven in utter desperation to commit suicide, of engaging in a cynical ploy of committing “asymmetrical warfare” !! He sounded that he was so devoid of humanity, as to appear to be an alien, so please reassure me that you haven’t left our World !

[faceless]

What I'm saying is that the initial Independent story was based more on sentimentality of these children missing their father rather than any facts known about the case, and that's just bollocks.

Why didn't the Independent mention the Spanish Authorities wanting to get their hands on him? Of course, I don't even know if that's actually the case as the only facts at our disposal are pretty vague.