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luke
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Location: by the sea
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 Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| so do a lot of scientists, there is no consensus among the scientific community as the media likes to make out |
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faceless
admin
Joined: 25 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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As you pointed out in another thread Luke - it's not just about global warming. Any sensible person realises that over consumption is unsustainable and CO2 production is just one part of that.
Anyway, let's get back to the topic. |
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popinjay
Joined: 02 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Yeah. Ron Paul, he's mental. He'd sell the working class to corporations quicker than you could snap your fingers. |
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luke
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Location: by the sea
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| Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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| popinjay wrote: | | Yeah, Ron Paul, he's mental. |
i quite like ron paul from what i've seen, but i don't know so much about him regards the things you bring up popinjay, but i can't vote anyway - i'm in england!
it'll be someone like giuliani or some other republican nutcase who wins it - i've read greg palasts book, they've got the whole voting system sorted - its game over if he's right ... |
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Mandy
Joined: 07 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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Yep, the whole voting system (especially the electronic voting machines which are easily rigged and have "secret" software) will make the election in the US a foregone conclusion.
At least one country in Europe threw out electronic voting machines since they didn't have a paper audit trail (since harder to rig elections if there is a paper audit trail).
To popinjay, I am with the poor, with the oppressed, with the ones who can't get justice, I am on the side of liberty and anti-prejudice. We clearly disagree on policies, and this boils down to either we disagree on where we want to get to, or on how we should get there. You seem to believe in the present false left/right theatre (as if clinton or brown are any different than Bush and Blair). I believe in a radical change, looking beyond simple labels. I think Ron Paul will be much better FOR THE POOR than most US presidential candidates. Clearly you don't agree.
| popinjay wrote: | | Yeah. Ron Paul, he's mental. He'd sell the working class to corporations quicker than you could snap your fingers. |
As if there is anything really substantial left to sell. The working class in the US is already ENSLAVED (via debt [wage indenture]). Ron Paul will begin the process of freeing them. |
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Mandy
Joined: 07 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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| popinjay wrote: | | She disbelieves that humans are the cause of it. |
More subtly, I don't believe that what we are being asked to do (e.g. by way of taxation on flights or saving energy) can have any significant impact. Whilst governments could make a big difference by not waging wars which consume HUGE energy amounts.
I also agree with face that people should reduce consumption .. but we don't hear that from the governments since reduced consumption would reduce profits and hurt the rich.
See : The governments want us to fall for the guilt trip that it is all our fault .. and we have to pay more taxes. We should instead be reducing consumption, and not just because of possible global warming effect, but that the planet can not sustain our greed [thank you luke for your footnotes] |
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faceless
admin
Joined: 25 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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| I know that if the products I use aren't recycled that I am contributing to the landfill, but there's no guilt in that - it's just logic. |
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harry perkins
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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| But I think Mandy makes a very important point that the establishment do try to guilt trip ordinary people and put the onus of change on them to cover for their own, and their free market's, inability/unwillingness to make the necessary changes. I also agree that if they did really begin to take it seriously the changes they would make would be to control and attack ordinary people even more, however I don't think that makes the majority scientific view a plot to justify such repression. What it does mean is that we need an entirely different kind of world system to save the planet for the benefit of all its inhabitants. |
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Mandy
Joined: 07 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 12:11 am Post subject: |
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| Amen to that. |
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luke
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Location: by the sea
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 12:13 am Post subject: |
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| harry perkins wrote: | | we need an entirely different kind of world system to save the planet for the benefit of all its inhabitants. |
amen to that  |
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luke
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Location: by the sea
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 12:13 am Post subject: |
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| lol jinx! |
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faceless
admin
Joined: 25 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 12:18 am Post subject: |
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| Ron Paul eh? |
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Mandy
Joined: 07 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:19 am Post subject: |
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Extract from above
"One of many truths Ron Paul's campaign is revealing is how hated real liberty is among the powers that be, how despised the individual, and how all-encompassing the contempt with which modern power brokers in Washington and New York hold the principles of the founders."
p.s. I had to look up
"FUBAR is an acronym that commonly means "Fucked Up Beyond All Repair", "Fucked Up Beyond Any Recognition", or the most common translation "Fucked Up Beyond All Recognition" from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FUBAR |
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Mandy
Joined: 07 Feb 2007
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luke
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Location: by the sea
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| Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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| funny really, the one guy who follows the constitution is labeled as 'not playing by the rules' |
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